I am incredibly disappointed and grieved - Archbishop Mouneer Anis

Assessment of the response the House of Bishops of TEC

to the Windsor Report and Dar El Salam recommendation

First, I would like to thank the Presiding Bishop of The Episcopal Church in America (TEC) for her kind invitation and for the great hospitality we enjoyed while we were in New Orleans.  I am also grateful for the opportunity I was given to address the House of Bishops (HOB).

It is very unfortunate that not all the members of the Joint Standing Committee (JSC) were present when a response to the HOB of TEC was drafted.  The lack of discussion and interaction will not produce a report that expresses the view of the whole committee.

The response of the House of Bishops of TEC represents a superficial shift from their previous position; the fact remains that their position since 2003 has not changed. The House of Bishops has not responded positively to either the Windsor Report or the Dar El Salam Primates recommendation.

Therefore I strongly disagree with the report of the JSC which states that "We believe that the Episcopal Church has clarified all outstanding questions relating to their response to the questions directed explicitly to them, and on which clarifications were sought by the 30th of September, and given the necessary assurance sought of them."   The reasons for my disagreement are as follows:

On Public Rites for Blessing of Same-sex Unions

The statement of the House of Bishops in New Orleans did not meet the request of Windsor Report that the "Bishops must declare a moratorium on all such public rites".  It also failed to meet the request of the Primates at Dar El Salam that the Bishops should "make an unequivocal common covenant that the Bishops will not authorize any rites of blessing for same-sex unions in their Diocese."

They did not declare a moratorium on authorization public rites of the blessing of same-sex unions.   Instead the House of Bishops pledged not to authorize any public rites of blessing of same-sex unions.  I understand moratorium as "cessation of activity". In the explanatory discussion they mentioned that "the majority", not all,  of Bishops do not make allowances for the blessings of same-sex unions.  This means that a number of Bishops will continue to make allowances for the blessing of same-sex unions.  I see this as an equivocal and unclear response.

While the House of Bishop’s response means that ‘authorization’ of the rites will not take place, but it also stated that some will continue to ’‘explore and experience liturgies celebrating the blessing of same-sex unions’‘.  The exploration of liturgies celebrating the blessing of same-sex unions, keeps a window to continue such blessings under another title!! This unashamedly disregards the standard teaching of the Anglican Communion which is still torn over this issue.

On the elections non-celibate gay and lesbian persons to the Episcopate

Those who read the whole response of the House of Bishops of TEC, not only parts of it, would find the following.

     
  • The House of Bishops clarified Resolution     B033 of the General Convention 2006 in such a way that "non-celibate     gay and lesbian persons are included in the restraint".  But in the same response we find them     saying "We proclaim the Gospel that in Christ all God’s children,    including gay and lesbian persons, are full and equal participants in the     life of Christ’s Church." What does this mean?  This statement contradicts their     explanation of B033 which put a restraint on electing and     consecrating non-celibate gay and lesbian persons to the Episcopate     Order, as it restricts them from full participation in the church.
     
  • The request of the House of Bishops to the     Archbishop of Canterbury to explore ways for Gene Robinson to fully     participate in Lambeth Conference demonstrates clearly that they see that     the manner of life of Gene Robinson, as a non-celibate gay, does not     present a challenge to the wider church and will not lead to further     strains on the Communion.    This again contradicts their     clarification of General Convention Resolution B033 that it does indeed refer     "to non-celibate gay and lesbian persons".

On the Pastoral Scheme 

In regard to the recommendation of Dar El Salam Primates Meeting, for the establishment of a Pastoral Council "to act on behalf of the Primates in consultation with the Episcopal Church", the House of Bishops did not respond positively. Their excuse was that such a pastoral scheme would compromise the authority of the Presiding Bishop, and place the autonomy of the Episcopal Church at risk.

The House of Bishops came up with another internal plan that allows the Presiding Bishop to appoint Episcopal visitors for Dioceses that ‘request’  alternative oversight.  This is completely different from the Pastoral scheme recommended by Dar El Salam.  The composition of the recommended pastoral scheme has the ability to stop the interventions of outside Provinces because it represents TEC, the Primates, and the Archbishop of Canterbury.

Suspending all Legal Actions

The Primates in Dar El Salam urged the representatives of TEC and of those congregations in property disputes with TEC to suspend all legal actions against each other.  The House of Bishops did not address this issue.

Conclusion

The House of Bishops did not respond meet the recommendation of Windsor Report and the Dar El Salam Primates Meeting Communiqué.  Instead they used ambiguous language and contradicted themselves within their own response.

The Most Rev. Dr. Mouneer Hanna Anis
  President Bishop of the Province of Jerusalem and the Middle   East
Member of the Primates Standing Committee

31 Responses. Comments closed for this entry.

  1. Father Ron Smith Says:

    The Global South Primates did not wait for the rest of the Anglican Primates to agree to their actions before they went ahead with subversive ordinations to infiltrate ECUSA’s territory.

    Why, then, should the majority of the members of the ACC Standing Committee have to wait for one of its members to approve their statement on the acceptability of ECUSA’ response to Tanzania?

    It would seem that Monsignor Anis needs to admit the failure of his own constituency to measure up to the demands of the Tanzania Communique - before he bleats about the supposed failure of the Standing Committee of the ACC to consider his own private response to ECUSA’ statement.

    Is his latest action really a sign of his unity with the Intruments of Communion?

  2. Gerry O'Brien, Newfoundland, Canada Says:

    Ron Smith:
    Your ignorance is only superceded by your arrogance.  The same arrogance that is shown by the HoB of TEC.  You continue to insist on the ways of TEC as being the only way and you cannot see the trees because of the forest that stands before you.

    Thank you to Archbishop Mouneer Anis for His absolute and forthright correction of what took place at New Orleans and for clarifying the foggy ways of TEC.  Bless You Archbishop Mouneer Anis.

  3. hannahelen Says:

    Archbishop Anis,  Thank you for your most honest talk before the EC HOB.  Your honest and humble accessment of the liberal HOB is Truth which, sadly & regretfully, the majority of those in the ec leadership can not and will not hear.  Thanks be to God for Godly men of your caliber who will speak up and come forward to aid and support those who believe and understand that the Gospel of Jesus Christ and redemption by His Blood does change lives,not leave them on the path of eternal darkness.

    Those who claim to shepherd the flock of Jesus Christ need to be changed by His Redemption before they attempt to ‘lead’.  The Bible speaks of a great falling away from the Gospel and they will come from within the Church.  Matt.13:24-30,36-43 is just one of the many scriptures which speak of this.  So why should we be surprised? 

    Blessings,
    hh

  4. Gary Morrow, Dahlonega, Georgia. USA Says:

    I found this at Americananglican.or, thought I would pass it on:

    The Church’s Unfoundation


    “A bit naughty this, but it made me laugh so I’m going to post it. This new ‘TEC hymn’ is circulating on a number of lists, so I thought some of our readers here might like to see it too. Read on…”

    The Anglican Communion
    Was mightily distressed
    When bishops of ECUSA
    Their heresies expressed,
    And in Convention showed not
    Repentance or regret,
    But chose to walk their own path,
    Firm in their own ways set.


    Political correctness
    And chic diversity –
    These are our church’s hallmarks,
    And quite our cup of tea.
    We follow where the winds blow,
    We are the church of NOW.
    We’re new Episcopalians
    And trendier than thou.

    Our gospel is inclusive.
    (The other one’s passé.)
    We welcome all the sexes,
    Transgendered, lesbigay.
    And though we’re loudly preaching
    Our relevant good news,
    We are a tad perplexed by
    So many empty pews.


    “To God alone be glory” -
    This used to be our song.
    With Katharine Jefferts Schori
    It likely won’t be long
    Before we change our story
    And sing another tune -
    Not Father, Son and Spirit,
    But Mother, Child and Womb.


    Our church has no foundation
    And Christ is not her Lord.
    She is our new creation
    By our own mighty word.
    The Bible’s too oppressive,
    And morals leave us bored.
    Who then is our salvation?
    It’s our own selves - adored

    Posted by Ruth Gledhill on September 28, 2007 at 04:38 PM

  5. Father Ron Smith Says:

    If the above posting is a true reflection of Ms. Ruth Gledhill’s journalisitic talents, then I suggest she ‘Hie herself to a nunnery’. And the sooner the better.

    To plagiarise one of the Universal Church’s best loved hymns is akin to some of the charismatic trash that now goes for music - together with the guitars and drum-kits of the ubiquitus youth groups that fill the new sanctuaries of the ‘Halleluia Brigade’

    A little more sensitivity to the tradition of the Universal Church might no come amiss.

  6. Gary Morrow, Dahlonega, Georgia. USA Says:

    Come on Smith, she said, ‘’...‘TEC hymn’ is circulating on a number of lists, so I thought some of our readers here might like to see it too. Read on…”

    ...is circulating…thought…readers…like to see it too.

    she found it on the net, and posted it on her site.

  7. Gary Morrow, Dahlonega, Georgia. USA Says:

    What Ron Smith will not tell his Congregation!

    Gays, Homosexuals, Perverts, Fornicators, etc.(unworthily) who shall eat this bread, and drink the cup of the Lord…eateth and drinketh his own damnation.

    So Smith, if you knowingly are giving Liturgies to such, you are ensuring yours and their damnation.

    1 Corinthians 11:
    27 (19) Wherefore, whosoever shall eat this bread, and drink the cup of the Lord (k) (*) unworthily, shall be guilty of the body and blood of the Lord.
    (19) Whosoever contemn the holy Sacraments, that is, use them not aright, are guilty not of the bread and wine, but of the thing itself, that is, of Christ, and shall be grievously punished for it. (k) Otherwise than meet is such mysteries should be handled.
    (*) By perverting the true and pure use of the same.
    28 (*) (20) Let (l) every man therefore examine himself, and so let him eat of this bread, and drink of this cup.
    (*) 2 Corinthians 13:5 .
    (20) The examination of a man’s self, is of necessity required in the Supper and therefore they ought not to be admitted unto it, which cannot examine themselves, as children, furious and mad men also such as either have no knowledge of Christ, or not sufficient, although they profess Christian’s Religion, and others such like. (l) This place beateth down the faith of credit, or unwrapped faith, which the Papists maintain.
    29 For he that eateth and drinketh unworthily, eateth and drinketh his own damnation, because he (m) discerneth not (*) the Lord’s body.
    (m) He is said to discern the Lord’s body, that hath consideration of the worthiness of it, and therefore cometh to eat of this meat with great reverence.
    (*) But as though these holy mysteries of the Lord’s body and blood were common meats, so without reverence he cometh unto them.

    I bet you hate God’s Bible, Smith.

    Have you ever preached this part of the Bible to your Congregation-doesn’t fit our political correctness agenda?

    This is another one of God’s Laws, that you would think is bigoted-non-inclusive. You see Smith, God was non-inclusive over and over again.

    Yes Smith, in your mind and heart, and Social Liberal’s mind and heart, God is a bigot, sexist, homophobe, just a plain old ‘phobe.

  8. Gerry O'Brien, Newfoundland, Canada Says:

    I cannot add anything to Gary’s words above to you Ron…. I guess I could say this about Ruth Gledhill’s quoted song….To TEC….If the shoe fits, wear it!!  I would say it fits just like cinderella’s shoe fit her.

  9. Gary Morrow, Dahlonega, Georgia. USA Says:

    Smith in post #5, states, “A little more sensitivity to the tradition of the Universal Church might no come amiss.”

    People, this is Elitist Socialism for you.

    Is the ordination of Homosexual, Female Bishops-“sensitivity to the traditions of the Universal Chruch”?

  10. Father Ron Smith Says:

    Misogyny - yet another problem in the camp of the Dissenters. (i.e. G.W. and a few others)

    A little reading of Church History would tell Gary that St. Brigid carried a pastoral staff and wore a mitre in the early Celtic Church (origins of the Church in Britain). Saint Julian of Norwich and St. Hilda of Whitby were also learned and formidable female influences in the Celtic Church. - Reality therapy in the face of what some people would like to think of as tradition, without any decent research on the subject.

  11. Gary Morrow, Dahlonega, Georgia. USA Says:

    The attributes of the pagan Brigid, such as healing powers, learning and poetic skill, were readily perceived in the saint who established a convent at Kildare. The name Kildare means “church of the oak”, and there was probably a pagan sanctuary there with a sacred fire which burned for centuries into the Christian era. By the time of Brigid’s death, c. 5 25, Kildare had become an important centre of learning.

    pa·gan     /ˈpeɪgən/ Pronunciation Key - Show Spelled Pronunciation[pey-guhn] Pronunciation Key - Show IPA Pronunciation
    –noun 1. one of a people or community observing a polytheistic religion, as the ancient Romans and Greeks. 
    2. a person who is not a Christian, Jew, or Muslim. 
    3. an irreligious or hedonistic person. 
    –adjective 4. pertaining to the worship or worshipers of any religion that is neither Christian, Jewish, nor Muslim. 
    5. of, pertaining to, or characteristic of pagans. 
    6. irreligious or hedonistic. 

    Wow, there where Female pagan Ron Smith’s back in those days-who would have thunk it.

    Boy, you really do have go back some years to find a non-angican to fill the void.

    I suppose the year 525…1Timothy 3 had not been translated into Celtic?

  12. Gerry O'Brien, Newfoundland, Canada Says:

    Ron Wrote:  “Reality therapy in the face of what some people would like to think of as tradition”

    Ron, the real challenge for you learned and wise persons of TEC and other wayward thinking churches is that all the knowledge of Church History just doesn’t have any impact when the speaker (you) has no Scriptural foundation to stand on other than the written words of KJS of TEC and GR of NH and others like them who wish to dissent from the real written word which is referred to as the “Holy Bible”.

    Scripture says quite plainly that when man lies with man it is an abomination in the eyes of God.  What part of that statement is it that you don’t understand. 

    What part of the Holy Bible will you disagree with tomorrow and with your cohorts say “Well, we don’t like that part so we will just ignore it”.
    Ron, that is what got us in trouble in the Garden of Eden.  That is what got Judas in trouble in the field of blood. 

    The problem you have is, “YOU FOLKS JUST DON’T GET IT”!!!! 

    O Lord, I pray to You in the precious name of Jesus Christ that You will cause Ron and Katharin and Gene and all of their same minded friends to open their minds, their hearts, their souls and their theology to the complete works of Your Book, Your Holy Bible, Your written Word. Amen”

  13. Gerry O'Brien, Newfoundland, Canada Says:

    Gary:
    Good to see you back and writing with wonderful knowledge….maybe this way is more effective than the URL system.  Either way, your work is effective and necessary against the church of ron.

  14. Gary Morrow, Dahlonega, Georgia. USA Says:

    Julian of Norwich ... she believed that beyond the reality of hell is yet a greater mystery of God’s love, she has also been referred to in modern times as a proto-universalist.[citation needed]Even though her views were not typical, local authorities did not challenge either her theology or her authority to make such faith claims because of her status as an anchoress.

    As part of her differing view of God as compassionate and loving, she wrote of the trinity in domestic terms and compares Jesus to a mother who is wise, loving, and merciful.(See Jesus as Mother by Carolyn Walker Bynum.) Similarly, she connects God with motherhood in terms of 1)“the foundation of our nature’s creation, 2) “the taking of our nature, where the motherhood of grace begins” and 3) “the motherhood at work” and speaks metaphorically of Jesus in connection with conception, nursing, labor, and upbringing. She, like many other great mystics, used female language for God as well as the more traditional male pronouns.

    Wow, this just keeps gettng better-another Jefferts Schori-“used female language for God”, “proto-universalist”.

    I smell revisionist, Smith. Boy, they had there kooks back then, too.

    Back then, when so few people had Gods Word-it was easy to play politics and bamboozle the masses. Not today buddy-roll, for I and every human being on this planet has God’s Laws, Words, and Commandments at their finger tips. It doen’t take a Saint, Bishop, Preacher, to tell the masses God Words, Laws, and Commandments. We shall hold your feet to the Word of God-Amen

  15. Gary Morrow, Dahlonega, Georgia. USA Says:

    Hilda of Whitby- Hilda (known in her own century as “Hild”) was the grandniece of King Edwin of Northumbria, a kingdom of the Angles.

    What do I smell appointment by power, politics, money, family influence. Archbishop of Canterbury-appointment by power governmental power…not by God’s Children. 1 Timothy 3 totally ignored.

    She was an abbess—woman who is the superior of a convent of nuns.

    Further reading:

    Hilda and her houses continued to follow the Celtic tradition. That tradition, with its emphasis on the feminine, its love of mysticism, story-telling and poetry, and its recognition of the sacredness of all creation has enjoyed a renaissance in modern times both in its literature and art.

    Emphasis on the feminine.

    Everytime I read about one of these females-it’s about the emphasis on the feminine, the same with Schori.

    God had his reasons for Male leadership in the Churches and I can imagine why. It is usually the female that pushes the homosexual agendas in the Churches-soft men, feminine women.

    The Church’s Unfoundation

    Not Father, Son and Spirit,
    But Mother, Child and Womb

  16. Father Ron Smith Says:

    I really am enjoying teaching you a ittle about the Bible, Gary - especially in the matter of our Blessed Lord’s attitude towards women in the Church.

    While conceding that Jesus did not call any woman officially to be an ‘Apostle’ - that is, a Leader of the Church community - is was because in his day, a woman’s word was not acceptable as legally reliable. Today, he would probably choose mostly women, because today’s society is no longer discriminatory against women (except, of course in the fundamentalist churches) and they are the majority of worshippers in the Church).

    Jesus’ respectful treatment of women, generally, was one of the reasons he was looked on with suspicion by the Scribes and Pharisees.

    Having experienced more than just a nodding acquaintance with the whole of the Bible myself, both as a Franciscan Brother and a priest of the Church, I have always been conscious of the need to ask God’s Holy Spirit to guide me in my reading and interpretation - a process which is called ‘Lecto Divina’.

    One of the more obvious traits of the New Testament’s reference to the ministry of Jesus, was his respect for, and encouragement of, women.

    Furthermore, the fact that the Evangelist Saint Mark (in his Gospel account) mentions a woman, Mary Magdalene, as being the first witness of Christ’s Resurrection, should at least help us all to understand Mary’s place in the ongoing proclamation of the Gospel - the Good News of Jesus’ Resurrection.

    In verses 10 & 11 of the final chapter of Mark’s Gospel, we see these words (Jerusalem Bible):

    “She (Mary) went to those who had been his (male?) companions, and who were in mourning and in tears, and told them. BUT THEY DID NOT BELIEVE HER when they heard her say that he was alive and that she had seen him”

    Here is early evidence of a WOMAN, trusted with the Good News of his resurrection by Jesus, being rebuffed by the male disciples of Jesus. What does this say about (a) the intent of Jesus, in trusting a woman with the proclamation of the Gospel? and (b) the present-day agnosticism of some biassed fundamentalists about the place of women in the Church? I rest my case.

    St. Francis of Assisi, whose Feastday was Oct. 4th, on sending 3 Brothers out on Mission, is said to have counselled them thus: “One of you must be Mother to the other two” - a mediaeval Saint who was speaking of the quality of loving concern that is a Gospel imperative.

    And this, too, you may not be aware of: Saint Julian of Norwich, who counselled commoners and kings - both men and women - was sometimes disposed to speak of ‘Father-Mother God’ - an aspect of God-ness that expresses how we are all (men and women) made in the ‘Image and likeness of God’ God has no time for misogyny - despite some of the O.T. prejudice against them.

    Jesus is the friend of both women and sinners! Thanks be to God!

  17. Gary Morrow Says:

    Ron states in post #16, “…teaching you…our Blessed Lord’s attitude towards women in the Church, Home, and Marriage.”

    Ron’s misguided premise is that “he knows” God had an attitude towards women. Ron knows more than the preacher Paul, John, etc.

    Ron continues, “Jesus did not call any woman officially… because in his day, a woman’s word was not acceptable as legally reliable. Today, he (Jesus) would probably choose mostly women…”

    Did you get that people, Ron ‘’knows’’ why Jesus in his day would not allow women to fulfill certain duties in the Churches, and in our home, and in our marriages.

    Ron continues to boast like Caesar, “because today’s society is no longer discriminatory against women (except, of course in the fundamentalist churches) and they are the majority of worshippers in the Church). 

    “...because today’s society is no longer discriminatory against women… [In other words, God, Jesus, and the apostles where discriminatory against women. They were bigots, racist, sexist, and the Bible must be modernized to conform to modernist perverts way of thinking-the enlightened. God plans for women must be revisited and reformed and repackaged to fit modern society. Ron knows that the Bible never changes but society is always changing, and the Bible doesn’t fit man’s desires, and woman desires anymore, it’s old and outdated. Women, also, must be the head of the Church and Man.].

    “… (except, of course in the fundamentalist churches) and they are the majority of worshippers in the Church).” [In other words, we are working very hard to enshrine a negative connotation to the word fundamentalist. Fundamentalist strictly adhere to the words, teaches, Law, Scripture, Commandments of God. We Socialist Liberals who want to water down, or dilute the word of God so that man can live with fewer restrictions, especially those annoying scriptures that teach against sexually immorality, and limiting women in the Churches. God’s Laws and Commandments are outdated. God was a homophobe, sexist, racist, fundamentalist, hater, bias, etc.].

    Here is what Words, Laws, and Commandments that Ron Smith, feminist, effeminates, hate about God, and what Ron will never tell his congregation.

    God’s is not against men or women. The Word of God is the Word of God.
    1 Corinthians 11:3 (King James Version) But I would have you know, that the head of every man is Christ; and the head of the woman is the man; and the head of Christ is God.

    1 Corinthians 11:4 (King James Version) Every man praying or prophesying, having his head covered, dishonoureth his head.

    Corinthians 11:5 (King James Version) But every woman that prayeth or prophesieth with her head uncovered dishonoureth her head: for that is even all one as if she were shaven.
    1 Corinthians 11:7 (King James Version) For a man indeed ought not to cover his head, forasmuch as he is the image and glory of God: but the woman is the glory of the man.

    1 Corinthians 11:8 (King James Version) For the man is not of the woman; but the woman of the man.

    1 Corinthians 11:9 (King James Version) Neither was the man created for the woman; but the woman for the man.

    1 Corinthians 11:8 (King James Version) For the man is not of the woman; but the woman of the man.

    1 Corinthians 11:9 (King James Version) Neither was the man created for the woman; but the woman for the man.
    —-
    1 Corinthians 11:12 (King James Version) For as the woman is of the man, even so is the man also by the woman; but all things of God.
    the woman was made for man, man also by the woman. ; but all things of GOD.
    —-
    1 Timothy 2:9 (King James Version) In like manner also, that women adorn themselves in modest apparel, with shamefacedness and sobriety; not with broided hair, or gold, or pearls, or costly array;

    1 Timothy 2:10 (King James Version) But (which becometh women professing godliness) with good works.
    —-
    1 Timothy 2:11 (King James Version) Let the woman LEARN in SILENCE with all subjection.
    1 Timothy 2:12 (King James Version) But I suffer not a WOMAN. to teach, nor to USURP AUTHORITY OVER A MAN but to be in SILENCE.
    1 Timothy 2:13 (King James Version) For Adam was first formed, then Eve.
    1 Timothy 2:14 (King James Version) And Adam was NOT DECEIVED, but the woman being DECEIVED was in the transgression.

    1 Timothy 2:15 (King James Version) Notwithstanding she shall be saved in childbearing, if they continue in faith and charity and holiness with sobriety.

    God has his plans for male and female, and here you come along and question God’s will.

    Ron questions God. Seems I read a story in the Bibe about a certain individuals question God’s wisdom, and plans.

    If only Ron Smith could rewrite the Bible?

    Which are you Ron-a homosexual, or a effeminate(soft male with female features)?

  18. Father Ron Smith Says:

    Gary, in the words of William Shakespeare;

    “Methinks thou protesteth too much!”

    In other words: “What’s bugging you, Gary?”

  19. Father Ron Smith Says:

    Oh, and by the way, Gary; I forget to mention that Hilda of Whitby was Abbess of a two-fold Monastery of both Men and Women.  Oh Dear me!

    Oh yes, and the Celtic Christians were the fore-runners of Christianity in the British Isles - long before the arrival of the Romans. How does that compare with the arrival of Christianity in North America, or even African for that matter?

  20. Gary Morrow, Dahlonega, Georgia. USA Says:

    Ron, oouucchh! I must have hit the target dead on. Anyway, just keep posting so that people can understand how Socialist Liberals think-you are the poster-boy that represents Socialist Liberals on this site.

    Oh, yea, you do hate the Bible—God’s Words, Laws, and Commandments.

    I just barely touch on some of God’s Commandments for women, and I bet your head spun around on your shoulders while fire shot out of your nostriles, and saliva foamed from your mouth.

    The Devil comes in many forms, and Socialist Liberals are one form-diluting the Bible, and the Churches by accepting perversions as Gospel.

  21. Gary Morrow, Dahlonega, Georgia. USA Says:

    re: Posing #19—Ron, try to focus. The average man, woman, and child do not have a copy of the Bible, and was totally dependent on a preacher.

    Again, every human being on this planet has access to God’s Words, Laws, and Commandments, except certain Muslim Countries.

    It was easy to manipulate and teach to the masses only what the polictical Elites wanted the masses to hear or conform to—Church of England for example, in bed with politicians then and today.

    Why do you think we have the Geneva Bible?

  22. Gary Morrow, Dahlonega, Georgia. USA Says:

    re: posting #21, that’s did not have a copy of the Bible back in those days…

  23. Father Ron Smith Says:

    In a final response to the previous post, and to set your strangely disordered mind at rest; I was probably reading the Bible, Gary, before you were a sparkle in your father’s eye.

    I do not hate the Bible, Gary, rather, I have been trained in its evaluation, believing that the Holy Spirit did not stop enlightening human minds after the publication of the first translation. I read from the Bible every day, and am led to reflect on its depest meaning by invoking the wisdom of the Holy Spirit - the Wisdom of God.

    Biblican scholars would agree that God’s Word in the Bible is a Light to our Path (the Psalms), but the Incarnation of Christ has since revealed the Person Who is THE WAY, THE TRUTH & THE LIFE of God. This is not to replace the Word of God in the Bible, but rather to accept the WORD Himself, who became flesh in a PERSON, as primary.

    Jesus once said to the Pharisees, “You read the Scriptures, but still you do not accept me” - the Person to whom the Scriptures were pointing. In order to make himself available to future generations of the Church, Jesus inaugurated, at the Last Supper, the sacrament of his Body and Blood to be a living memorial of himself, for us to receive as the baptized children of God.

    This is why it is so important not to just read the scriptures, but to ‘read, mark learn and inwardly digest them’. To receive the Eucharist of Christ is to ‘inwardly digest’ the Incarnate Word of God. - All incredibly scriptural! If you need further teaching on this important issue, I am prepared to help. Just ask!

  24. Gary Morrow, Dahlonega, Georgia. USA Says:

    re: post #23, all that gobbledygook that you just puked out becomes null and void because you can’t even find that God Commanded that man lieth with man like woman is an abomination.

    How does your congregation take you serious. You are a Joke.

  25. Gerry O'Brien, Newfoundland, Canada Says:

    Ron Smith:  You were probably reading the Bible before Gary Morrow was a sparkle in his fathers eye!!!  Your words above.  What an astute statement. 

    You’ve been reading it all this time and you still “DON’T GET IT”.  All this time and you’ve been reading words, not the living Truth.  Unless you are Born Again and have confessed your sins, repented of them and turned from them 180 degrees…..You just won’t GET IT!

    We don’t hate you Ron, we just hate the sin that is spoken clearly of in the Holy Bible.

    I do hate what the evil one has his workers on this earth doing and it seems that the evil one, has appeared in one of his many ways, this time as a man masquerading as a priest…..A wolf in sheep’s clothing. I wonder how many of them are there out in the flock trying to devour God’s people?  Are you one Ron?

  26. Gary Morrow, Dahlonega, Georgia. USA Says:

    Proverbs 7
    1 My son, keep my words, and hide my commandments with thee.
    2 Keep my commandments, and thou shalt live, and mine instruction as the apple of thine eyes.
    3 Bind them upon thy fingers, and write them upon the table of thine heart.

    God’s Commandment-man shall not lieth with man as he lieth with woman; it is abomination.

    Smith hates God’s Bible. Smith hates these verses.

    Keep my commandments, Smith, saith the Lord…and thou shalt live…

  27. Gary Morrow, Dahlonega, Georgia. USA Says:

    How about it Smith…God is calling you to repent…before it is too late.

    Go ask for forgiveness Smith, ask God to forgive you for not upholding his Commandments, instructions, etc., and that this day foreword, you will live the Will of God.

  28. Father Ron Smith Says:

    Gary, I have a remedy for your ill-temper, It is called Gripe-water. Taken three times a day it could improve your bowels, your temperament and possibly, your use of the English language.

    By the way, from your invective, you hardly sound like the typical Anglican. I think perhaps the emerging Church of the Global South might yet be able to use you in its campaign for purity. Your appetite for ethnic cleansing could well be a problem, though. Seek guidance on this!

  29. Gerry O'Brien, Newfoundland, Canada Says:

    Smith:  What, in your learned opinion does a typical Anglican sound like.  Does it have a cockney accent?  Maybe Irish, Kenyan, Ugandan, Southern USA; Aussie; kiwi?  Maybe Chinese, Vietnamese, Yiddish, Iraqui, Turkish, Italian?  Just what does one sound like?

    I guess you mean what does one look like?  Same thing.

    Maybe you really mean, does an anglican believe in the Holy Bible, Really? 
    Maybe you are really saying a typical anglican is supposed to sound like you, Smith….geez, I hope not.  Global South doesn’t sound like you smith.
    An awful lot of great anglicans (episcopalians) in the USA don’t sound like you either…they have scruples.

    ‘nuff said.

  30. Gary Morrow, Dahlonega, Georgia. USA Says:

    Ron, I have to admit it, my English is terrible. You should hear my Southern accent-Ya’ll would not be able to understand me. You might be a redneck if you go to your family reunion to look for a date. You might be a redneck if your family tree goes in a straight line. You might be a redneck if your children play under the front porch.

    This should help explain the South!

    300 Reasons you might be a Redneck…
    Thank you Jeff Foxworthy!
    You think “loading the dishwasher” means getting your wife drunk.
    You ever cut your grass and found a car.
    You own a home that is mobile and 5 cars that aren’t.
    You think the stock market has a fence around it.
    Your stereo speakers used to belong to the Drive-in Theater.
    Your boat has not left the drive-way in 15 years.
    You own a homemade fur coat.
    Chiggers are included on your list of top 5 hygiene concerns.
    You burn your yard rather than mow it.
    Your wife has ever said, “Come move this transmission so I can take a bath.”
    You read the Auto Trader with a highlight pen.
    The Salvation Army declines your mattress.
    You’ve ever raked leaves in your kitchen.
    Birds are attracted to your beard.
    Your wife’s job requires her to wear an orange vest.
    You were shooting pool when any of your kids were born.
    You have the local taxidermist’s number on speed dial.
    You’ve ever hit a deer with your car…deliberately.
    Your school fight song was “Dueling Banjos”.
    You think a chain saw is a musical instrument.
    You’ve ever given rat traps as gifts.
    You clean your fingernails with a stick.
    Your coffee table used to be a cable spool.
    You keep a can of RAID on the kitchen table.
    Your wife can climb a tree faster than your cat.
    Your mother has “ammo” on her Christmas list.
    Every socket in your house breaks a fire code.
    You’ve totaled every car you’ve ever owned.
    There are more than five McDonald’s bags in your car.
    The Home Shopping operator recognizes your voice.
    There has ever been crime-scene tape on your bathroom door.
    You’ve ever been kicked out of the zoo for heckling the monkeys.
    The taillight covers of your car are made of red tape.
    You think a subdivision is part of a math problem.
    You’ve ever bathed with flea and tick soap.
    You think “taking out the trash” means taking your in-laws to a movie.
    You have every episode of Hee-Haw on tape.
    You’ve ever been involved in a custody fight over a hunting dog.
    Your considered an expert on wormbeds.
    Your kids take a siphon hose to “Show and Tell.”
    The dog catcher calls for a backup unit when visiting your house.
    You’ve ever bought a used cap.
    Your CB antenna is a danger to low-flying planes.
    You pick your teeth from a catalog.
    You’ve ever financed a tattoo.
    You’ve ever stolen toilet paper.
    You think a hot tub is a stolen bathroom fixture.
    People hear your car a long time before they see it.
    The gas pedal on your car is shaped like a bare foot.
    You prefer car keys to Q-tips.
    You take a fishing pole into Sea World.
    You think a turtleneck is key ingredient for soup.
    You’ve ever stood in line to have your picture taken with a freak of nature.
    You think the French Riviera is foreign car.
    You go to a stock car race and don’t need a program.
    You’ve ever filled your deer tag on the golf course.
    you have ever used lard in bed.
    you own more than 3 shirts with cut off sleeves.
    you have ever spray-painted your girlfriends name on an overpass.
    your lifetime goal is to own a fireworks stand.
    someone asks to see your ID and you show them your belt buckle.
    The primary color of your car is bondo.
    directions to your house include “Turn off the paved road.”
    your dog and your wallet are both on a chain.
    you owe the taxidermist more than your annual income.
    you ever lost a tooth opening a beer bottle.
    Jack Daniels makes you list of most admired people.
    your wife’s hairdo has ever been ruined by a ceiling fan.
    you see no need to stop at a rest stop ‘cause you have an empty milk jug.
    you consider the fifth grade you senior year.
    you have a rag for a gas cap.
    the dog can’t watch you eat without gagging.
    you have a hefty bag where the window of your car should be.
    you have ever bar-b-qued Spam on the grill.
    your brother-in-law is also your uncle.
    Redman Chewing Tobacco sends you a Christmas card.
    you bought a VCR because wrestling comes on while you’re at work.
    your dad walks you to school because you’re in the same grade.
    you view the next family reunion as a chance to meet girls.
    your wife has a beer belly and you find it attractive.
    your front porch collapses and kills more than five dogs.
    the main course at potluck dinners is roadkill.
    you mow the front yard and find a car.
    your other truck is made by John Deere.
    you think suspenders are a type of shirt.
    going to the bathroom at night involves shoes and a flashlight.
    you keep a spit cup on the ironing board.
    you ever got too drunk to fish.
    More than one living relative is named after a southern civil war general.
    http://www.countryhumor.com/redneck/mightbe.htm

  31. Father Ron Smith Says:

    Such a load of Crap as I have never before encountered. Even the doings of the KKK would make more intelligent reading. Have you thought of seeing a psychiatrist for your distemper?